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    W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

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    Lord Kai

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Lord Kai on Mon Jul 21, 2014 2:24 am

    More brainstorming after last play-test ...  Thoughts on this version?  I am going with 80-points, assuming that you'd have 3-squads of Sylvans supporting him.  That is a 200-point investment in your army for mostly defensive purposes.  Because of the lower cost, I am going with lower Life and Attack, but adding Forest Avenger's Spirit to give the Sylvans more "punch" in the End-Game. Thought about swapping the Attack/Defense but worry Defense 3 is too low.

    TAWARTHION

    Figure: Heroclix, Mutant Mayhem, Man-Thing, # 61

    General: Aquilla
    Planet: Eberron

    Species: Primordial
    Unique Hero
    Class: Protector
    Personality: Wild
    Medium 5

    Life: 5
    Move: 5
    Range: 1
    Attack: 3
    Defense: 4

    80 Points

    WOODLAND COMMANDER
    Before taking a turn with Tawarthion, you may take a turn with one squad of Sylvan Animae that you control.

    SPIRIT TRANSFER
    Instead of moving normally, you may reveal an X order marker on this card to activate Spirit Transfer. Choose a Sylvan Animae that you control. You may switch Tawarthion and the chosen figure. Figures moved by Spirit Transfer never take leaving engagement attacks. On the turn Tawarthion moves with Spirit Transfer he may attack any and all figures adjacent to him. Roll each attack separately.

    FOREST AVENGER’S SPIRIT
    When Tawarthion is destroyed, place this figure on any Elementar squad that follows Aquilla.  Avenger’s Spirit adds 1 to the normal attack number on that card.
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    Lord Kai

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Lord Kai on Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:46 pm

    I think I am just about done with Tawarthion.  Poor guy has been in development for too long : )

    Lord Kai wrote:
    FOREST AVENGER’S SPIRIT
    When Tawarthion is destroyed, place this figure on any Elementar squad that follows Aquilla.  Avenger’s Spirit adds 1 to the normal attack number on that card.


    I think the Forest Avenger's Spirit works well to make the Sylvans better clean-up figures.  The very nature of the Sylvans is to provide some Defense and cover against range.  Tawarthion moves them from a filler squad into a more cohesive support unit.  And when the big guy goes down - he gives the Sylvans a much needed attack boost for the end-game.

    I would like to have the Forest Avenger's Spirit add +1 attack to a medium common squad with a Range of 1 that follows Aquilla.  That would include:

    Sylvan Animae
    Quasatch Hunters
    Granite Guardians
    Blade Dancers


    I am specifying Medium so that Dwarves are not included.



    If that's too much, I will limit it to Sylvans and Quasatch - but I think a cool army would be:

    Tawarthion ... 80
    Sylvans x3 ... 200
    Q. Hunters x3 ... 500

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    Nomad

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Nomad on Thu Jul 31, 2014 10:52 pm

    I am OK with the changes to make Tawarthion an 80 point figure. I really liked where he was at, but was thinking that 140 points was just a bit too high. Thank you for keeping the Spirit Transfer and Woodland Commander powers.

    For Spirit Transfer, thematically it makes sense to me to keep the bonus to other figures who are of a similar breed, namely the Sylvan and Eilan Sidhe. Tawarthion would not seem out of place in an Ullar army at all. I don't think the Blade Dancers need the bump in attack. The Granites seem OK with Torver and Stenvar. The army build you mentioned still works - the Quasatch get the move bonus from the Sylvan along with the defense bonus from ranged attacks. I would rather find a way to supplement the Quasatch with another figure down the line.

    So, here is my two cents . . .

    TAWARTHION

    Figure: Heroclix, Mutant Mayhem, Man-Thing, # 61

    General: Aquilla
    Planet: Eberron

    Species: Primordial
    Unique Hero
    Class: Protector
    Personality: Wild
    Medium 5

    Life: 5
    Move: 5
    Range: 1
    Attack: 3
    Defense: 4
    80 Points

    WOODLAND COMMANDER
    Before taking a turn with Tawarthion, you may take a turn with one squad of Sylvan Animae or one squad of Eilan Sidhe that you control.

    SPIRIT TRANSFER
    Instead of moving normally, you may reveal an X order marker on this card to activate Spirit Transfer. Choose a Sylvan Animae or Eilan Sidhe that you control. You may switch Tawarthion and the chosen figure. Figures moved by Spirit Transfer never take leaving engagement attacks. On the turn Tawarthion moves with Spirit Transfer he may attack any and all figures adjacent to him. Roll each attack separately.

    FOREST AVENGER’S SPIRIT
    When Tawarthion is destroyed, place this figure on a Sylvan Animae or Eilan Sidhe Army Card. Avenger’s Spirit adds 1 to the normal attack number on that card.
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    Lord Kai

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Lord Kai on Fri Aug 01, 2014 2:27 pm


    Awesome, I am down for focusing on Eilan Sidhe and Sylvan Animae. Thanks for the input. I think this 80-point version is pretty solid.
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    Nomad

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Nomad on Sat Aug 16, 2014 4:19 pm

    Kai, can you change the OP to reflect the latest?

    I think his size should be Medium 6.

    First attempt on the card . . .



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    Lord Kai

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Lord Kai on Tue Aug 19, 2014 6:41 pm

    OP updated.
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    Nomad

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Nomad on Sun Sep 28, 2014 7:30 pm

    After a couple more play tests with Tawarthion, I'm still not convinced he is quite there yet. I love the powers and were he is at, but I'm wondering if he should have one more defensive die (bumping to 5), or one more life (bumping to 6). It may seem that this would make him more powerful, but it would also delay when the Sylvan/Sidhe get to bump their attack by one.

    It just seems he falls pretty quickly.

    Thoughts?
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    Admin
    Admin

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Admin on Mon Sep 29, 2014 2:46 pm

    Nomad wrote:After a couple more play tests with Tawarthion, I'm still not convinced he is quite there yet. I love the powers and were he is at, but I'm wondering if he should have one more defensive die (bumping to 5), or one more life (bumping to 6). It may seem that this would make him more powerful, but it would also delay when the Sylvan/Sidhe get to bump their attack by one.

    It just seems he falls pretty quickly.

    Thoughts?

    Yeah, this guy has been the bane of my design work : (

    I thought I had him down with his current iteration, and while he 'works' I don't want to turn out a mediocre custom.

    Let's put him on the shelf for Wave 3 since Kronan seems to be rockin' for Primordials for this release.
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    Nomad

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Nomad on Fri Oct 10, 2014 7:44 pm

    No! Let's not put him on the shelf yet. I really like his powers and synergy. I'm just thinking that adding one more life or one more die to his defense might do the trick. Something that gives him a little better chance to pull of his Spirit Transfer attack.

    Please . . . let's try it in some play testing.
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    Nomad

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Nomad on Thu Oct 30, 2014 9:12 pm

    What do we think about adding one more life or one more defense? See previous post.
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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Admin on Fri Oct 31, 2014 1:27 am

    Nomad wrote:What do we think about adding one more life or one more defense? See previous post.

    I could see an extra life. We don't get 6-Life figures in the cost range of 80 - 90 except for Sir Hawthorne and Myrrdin. Hawthorne does bond with the Knights of Weston but he costs 10 more points.

    Against Ranged attacks, Tawarthion should have +1 Defense if he has bonded with one Sylvan Animae and kept them adjacent. He'd be 6 Defense against range with a base +1 and a Sylvan. Might be too much.

    I wish this guy worked a little better. I think the Sylvans are a little too "filler" and I've been trying to upgrade them through this Primordial. I don't know if it is quite working .. but maybe some more testing.
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    Derek S

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Derek S on Wed Nov 19, 2014 2:41 pm

    I think if you do add, adding to life is the way to go. Sorry I still haven't playtested this guy either.
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    Nomad

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Nomad on Sun Nov 23, 2014 12:34 pm

    We got a play test in yesterday . . . Tawarthion had the potential for his best showing, but fail to 8/9 skulls from the hands of a single Slayer before he could pull off his Spirit Transfer - then Kai lost OM's for the round which made the difference in the battle. At 80 points, adding a life or defense might be too much. I think he is fine right were he is. Let's get some play tests in where Tawarthion is matched up with some Sidhe.
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    Lord Kai

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Lord Kai on Sun Nov 23, 2014 4:02 pm

    Nomad wrote:We got a play test in yesterday . . . Tawarthion had the potential for his best showing, but fail to 8/9 skulls from the hands of a single Slayer before he could pull off his Spirit Transfer - then Kai lost OM's for the round which made the difference in the battle. At 80 points, adding a life or defense might be too much. I think he is fine right were he is. Let's get some play tests in where Tawarthion is matched up with some Sidhe.

    Yeah, I was actually thinking he might do well in that game .. should not have picked up a glyph and given the Slayer height + accusation of evil : (

    For a 500-point Army though, it helped the "Monkeys" be more competitive:

    Sylvan Animae x 3 .... 120
    Tawarthion ... 200
    Quasatch Hunters x 3 ... 500
    = 500

    I realized late in the game that I could have arranged for 9-move Q'Hunters (+2 for Trees and +2 for Sylvans). At one point, I had Tawarthion's Forest Avenger power being able to drop on the Q'Hunters when he was destroyed. I might look at that again because the Monkeys aren't all that great at 100 points.

    But hey - I had fun playing them!
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    Nomad

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Nomad on Fri Jan 16, 2015 7:40 pm

    We got some play tests in with Tawarthion a few weeks ago. I really like where he is at. I think we just need to do some play tests with Sidhe to see if he is ready to go.
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    Nomad

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Nomad on Fri Jan 16, 2015 8:53 pm

    I've adjusted the coloring of Tawarthion and lightened the background.



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    Derek S

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Derek S on Sat Jan 17, 2015 9:19 am

    looks good.
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    Nomad

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Nomad on Sat Jan 31, 2015 7:23 pm

    We got a play test in today with Tawarthion and Eilen Sidhe. Everything passes and I think Tawarthion is good to go.

    Here is the card redo:



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    Derek S

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Derek S on Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:09 pm

    The woodland commander power makes me nervous about potential bonding loops. The Dreadgul Raiders almost provide that as is. I really dislike the after revealing an order marker on, but I could see that as necessary in this wording.

    Also, (just throwing out a crazy last minute idea) instead of specifically mentioning the Eilan Sidhe or Sylvan Animae, what about mentioning Elementar or Sidhe (squad). This would end up including the Granite Guardians and could create for some interesting synergies down the road.
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    Lord Kai

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Lord Kai on Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:38 pm

    I'm okay adding the "After revealing OM .. " wording.

    Elementar and Sidhe would be cool. I don't see adding Tawarthion into a Granite Guardian build but in a large point game, you could have animated Trees and Rocks .. with Sylvan's providing some ranged defensive cover.

    The Bio that was thinking of really involves "forest/woodland" powers though.
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    Lord Kai

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Lord Kai on Thu Feb 05, 2015 5:37 pm

    First draft of Bio:

    Tawarthion, Prime Master of the Forest

    Hailing from Eberron, the elven enchanter Tawarthion (Tah-WAHR-thee-on) joined the Order of Primordials after over a century of studying sorcery and druidic magics.  Channeling his fey blood, as well as rituals for crafting enchanted items, Tawarthion was able to infuse mystical energies into plant life.  These energies allowed plants to move and grow, taking limited humanoid forms known as the Sylvan Animae.

    Hoping to expand his control of woodland magic, Tawarthion created an organic suit of armor composed of plant life.  This armor was similar to the husks used to house the energies of the Sylvan Animae.  It provided protection nearly as strong as plate armor and increased his own strength.  In order to keep the bio-armor functioning, it draws upon stored energy within other Animates, such as the Sylvans or other tree spirits like the Eilan Sidhe.  If the armor is destroyed, the mystical energy stored within is shifted back to the Animae.  The Sylvans can take that surge of power and channel it into greater strength for their attacks.
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    Nomad

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Nomad on Thu Feb 05, 2015 7:20 pm

    The bio sounds great. Did you want to mention the cool Spirit Transfer in there?

    I'd prefer not do bonding with the Granites or future Elementars - my opinion.
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    Lord Kai

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Lord Kai on Thu Feb 05, 2015 7:57 pm

    Nomad wrote:The bio sounds great. Did you want to mention the cool Spirit Transfer in there?

    I'd prefer not do bonding with the Granites or future Elementars - my opinion.


    Ah good point, I'll work that in.
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    Lord Kai

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Lord Kai on Fri Feb 06, 2015 5:00 pm

    Updated:

    Tawarthion, Prime Master of the Forest
    Hailing from Eberron, the elven enchanter Tawarthion (Tah-WAHR-thee-on) joined the Order of Primordials after over a century of studying sorcery and druidic magics. Channeling his fey blood, as well as rituals for crafting enchanted items, Tawarthion was able to infuse mystical energies into plant life. These energies allowed plants to move and grow, taking limited humanoid forms known as the Sylvan Animae.

    Hoping to expand his control of woodland magic, Tawarthion created an organic suit of armor composed of plant life. This armor was similar to the husks used to house the energies of the Sylvan Animae. It provided protection nearly as strong as plate armor and increased his own strength. To use the bio-armor, Tawarthion enters a dreamlike state where his spirit leaves his body and inhabits the husk. In this way, his mortal body is safe and only the armor is at risk. With his apprentices watching over him, Tawarthion can travel in the bio-armor for several miles before the mystical connection begins to fray.

    To augment the connection between his host body and the bio-husk, Tawarthion crafted the Sylvan Animate with the same basic structure as his armor. Because of this, Tawarthion is able to transport his spirit into the husk of an Animae, and with the assistance of a complex conjuration spell, transfer the bio-armor as well. With this spirit transfer, Tawarthion can enter the form of one of his Animae, essentially switching locations with them.

    In order to keep the bio-armor functioning, it draws upon stored energy within other Animates, such as the Sylvans or other tree spirits like the Eilan Sidhe. If the armor is destroyed, the mystical energy powering the bio-armor can be shifted back and distributed to the other Animae husks. The Sylvans can take that surge of power and channel it into greater physical strength for their attacks.
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    Derek S

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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

    Post  Derek S on Fri Feb 06, 2015 6:52 pm

    The Book of Tawarthion

    NWHC WAVE 3- ?


    - Rulings and Clarifications -
    _______________________________________



    - Combinations and Synergies -

    Synergy Benefits Offered
    -Tawarthion: Woodland Commander

    Sylvan Animae or Eilan Sidhe may take a turn before Tawarthion with WOODLAND COMMANDER’S bonding option.
    -Tawarthion: Spirit Transfer
    Instead of moving normally, Tawarthion may reveal a X marker and trade places with a Sylvan Animae or Eilan Sidhe and attack all adjacent figures.
    -Tawarthion: Forest Avenger’s Spirit
    Sylvan Animae or Eilan Sidhe may benefit from Tawarthions FOREST AVENGER’S SPIRIT attack bonus if a destroyed Tawarthion is placed on their card.
    -Protector: Dimensional Leap
    Being a Protector, Tawarthion may aid figures with the DIMENSIONAL LEAP placement power. Figures with the DIMENSIONAL LEAP power include Michael Davion, Alyssa Davion.

    Synergy Benefits Received

    Synergy Imposed


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    Re: W3 Tawarthion - (Forest Primordial) - released

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