W1 Minotaurs of Nullondia-Released

Yeah, 10th Reg with Raelin against all melee ... Ouch. What's that - 5 Defense and a Marcu + Wait then Fire bonus.

I'd still say that 90-points is good for the Minotaurs. Their 4/4 stats are similar to the Hornskull Brutes at 75 points, so the bonding is at least worth another 15 points to get to 90. They might be worth more by other 'Scaper standards.

Tecer at 4 Life is worth the 110 points, but that's his flaw. If you want to bump him to 5 life - I'd go up to 120 points.


Going to be a very fun unit!!!

NAME OF THE TEST UNIT: Minotaurs of Nullondia

THEME TEST: Are there are any powers or stats on the test unit card that do not accurately reflect the theme or likeness of what the character should be able to do? Also consider whether or not this character's powers should affect destructible objects.

Really not necessary to have Minotaurs move a space as they have to start their turn unengaged to use the power.


FUN TEST: Was the unit fun to play?

. In the next 2 games they were fun to play as well.


FUN OPPOSITION TEST: Was the unit acceptable to play against? Could it be considered annoying?

The unit makes you consider the placement of your figures, often causing an effort to keep the Minotaurs from getting first strike from a distance. I do like the way the unit plays.


USAGE TEST: Were all of the powers on this card used, or at least usable?

Scent of the Prey was used several times and Gore with mixed results, if Gore works these guys are real good, if it fails you are giving up a 4 attack which is pretty fun consideration.


STRATEGY TEST: Does the unit offer any real strategy or interesting tactics to the overall game?

Placement strategy for both sides is increased with these guys.

BONDING TEST: Compare the unit card with all currently existing Bonding abilities. Are there any Bonding loops that do not stop appropriately?

They bond with Minotaur heroes and I did not run across any bonding loops.


SYNERGIES TEST: Think of all the current cards that would have synergy with the unit card. Are there any factors that could break the game by making a unit too powerful or too weak?

All figures that add to the 20-sider help, (Myrddin, bell guy). Raelin would make them real formidable but I think they would often out run her so I don’t think it would be anything that is not already seen with Raelin. I don’t think there are many others that offer any synergy.


POWER CHECK: When considering the test unit against all existing units (including released C3V and SoV units) and all glyphs, are there any powers that could be overamplified and break the game? Each power should define when it takes place, who or what it affects, and what conditions (if any) apply.

I think all checks clear here. Move +2 could really help them. I think all powers are clearly defined as to when they take place and what conditions apply (must move in a straight line and count the spaces in between original placement.


DRAFTING TEST: Is this unit worth drafting?

Yes, very fun.


MIRROR TEST: Consider the test unit against itself. Are there any loops that would upset the balance of the Game?

Not that I see.



ARMY TEST 1

Did the unit perform adequately? What should be the unit's point value? Give a brief summary.
[Yes, I thought the unit performed adequately, I think 85-95 points is appropriate. Their speed with Scent of Prey and versatility for potentially 6 kills is formidable. Tecer held his own both games and Apeo proved useful as well. ]


Map: [Smokeys Lament]
Units: Army 1: [Tecer 110, Apeo 30, Minotaurs x4 at 90] ([500]) VS Army 2: [KoW x3, Finn, Thorgrim, Sir Orrick, Gilbert] ([515])

Rd1- on final order marker Tecer kills 1 knight in range, a Minotaur Scent of Preys on road for 9 move & kill on knight (3sk 2sh), another Minotaur blocked by Finn (thorgrimm) (3sk 3sh), Minotaur gets a knight on height (2sk 1sh).

Rd2- Tecer gets height and kills knight (thorgrimm 2sk 1sh) and 1 wound on Finn (thorgrimm 2sk 1sh), 3 Minotaurs get height, one 1 wounds Gilber (2sk 1sh), kill a knight (3sk 1sh), wound Finn (thorgrimm 1sk 0sh). Gilbert gets height on Minotaur & kills (3sk 1sh), a Knight misses a Minotaur on height, a Knight (Gilbert) gets a Minotaur (3sk 0sh), Knight (finn & gilbert) blocked by Tecer on height (2sk 2sh). Tecer kills Finn (thorgrimm) with double attack (2sk 1sh-2sk 0sh), a Minotaur misses Gore (1 space with 8 roll) on Knight with height & Thorgrimm, a Minotaur kills knight (1sk 0sh), a Minotaur whiffs on Gilbert. Finn placed on Gilbert. Gilbert 2 wounds Tecer (3sk 1sh), knight with height kills a Minotaur (1sk 0sh), Knight with height & Gilbert blocked by a Minotaur (1sk 3sh). Tecer on Gilbert (3sk 0sh- 2sk 0sh) for kill, a Minotaur blocked by Thorgrimm (1sk 1sh), a Minotaur with height 5sk for kill on Knight. Orrick moves 6 & kill Mino on height (2sk 0sh), 3 Knights surround Tecer (2sk 1sh- 1sk 1sh- 1sk 2sh) for 1 wound, last Knight with height kills a Minotaur. (2 knights die to lava, Tecer and 1 knight safe)

Rd 3- Thorgrimm kills a Mino (1sk 0sh), 1 knight blocked by Tecer on height (1sk 2sh), a Knight whiffs roll, a Knight kills Tecer (3sk 2sh). Minotaurs move up. Knights get height with Thorgrimm. Minotaur puts 1 wound on Thorgrimm on height (2sk 1sh), 1 Minotaur kills a knight on height with 4sk 1sh roll. Thorgrimm with height misses attack on Minotaur, a Knight with height misses a Minotaur (2sk 2sh), a Knight with height kills a Minotaur (3sk 1sh). Apeo kills a knight, Minotaur kills last knight (height & thorgrimm) with (4sk 3sh) roll. 2 Minotaurs attack Thorgrimm (2sk 1sh) Thorgrimm with height (4sk 2sh) for kill. (1 Minotaur dies to lava, Apeo takes 1 wound)

Rd 4- A Minotaur on Orrick (thorgrimm) (3sk 1sh), Minotaur with height whiffs. Orrick blocked by Minotaur (2sk 2sh). Apeo with 5 attack kills Orrick (2sk 1sh).

2 life Apeo and 5 Minotaurs left 170pts.


ARMY TEST 2

Did the unit perform adequately? What should be the unit's point value? Give a brief summary.
[Yes all 3 were adequate, Tecer and Apeo look good, Minotaurs around 90. The use of Gore on High defense or Aura’d figures is extremely useful. I think 90 is pretty close.]


Map: [Shattered]
Units: Army 1: [same] ([army 1 point total]) VS Army 2: [same] ([army 2 point total])
Spoiler Alert!

Same armies as the previous post on the same map

Rd 1- Knight blocked by Minotaur (2sk 2sh). Apeo (height & friendly) kills knight ( 3 sk 2sh) 2 Minotaurs blocked by knight (2sk 2sh- 1sk 2sh), a Minotaur kills a knight (thorgrim) (2sk 1 sh).

rd 2- Gilbert with height kills Minotaur (1sk 0sh), a knight with height blocked (2sk 2sh), 2nd Knight kill Mino 2sk 0sh), 3rd blocke 2sk 3sh. Tecer kills knight on height, blocked by even height, a Minotaur with height blocked by knight 2 sk 2 sh, Minotaur kills knight (1sk 0 sh). Thorgrim(gilbert)....

Yadda Yadda Ya. Rolls are pretty even. Tecers double attack proves worthy, Minotaurs ability to get height make a hugh difference in this game. Minotaurs hold their own and end up winning with 2 Minotaurs left. Apeo does well better than 3o pts. Tecer performs well. Minotaurs hold their own......I can detail it more if chosen.

Thanks for the battle reports.

Curious on how Sir Orrick has been performing, since I haven't played him yet (though he's in my collection thanks to you!).

--
I think Minotaurs are pretty tough Melee vs Melee.  They certainly need Tecer with double-attack to compete with Knights + Champion to each have an equal # of attacks (5).

Once they get engaged they aren't able to Gore right, so melee versus melee is straight up dice.  I'm sure the Knights with Thorgrim and Finn were challenging.

90-points feels about right for the squad.

Did Apeo feel right at just 30-points?

Thanks for the reports! I am not surprised they were beat by a range army, but that first battle was a slaughter. Sounds like the battles against KoW were fairly close, which is good.

Minotaurs at 90 sound OK to me.

If played right, do you think Tecer is worth 110, or should he be lowered? How did Bull Rush fare?

Do you think Apeo is worth 30 or should he be bumped a little? Was his added die bonus too much for a 30 pointer?

If I get a chance, I will try to get in a play test this weekend.

FYI ... there was a thread on Heroscapers about Arcane Legion mini's. They have pre-painted Minotaurs in their Demo Kit.


http://www.miniaturemarket.com/wls016.html

http://www.livingdice.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/IMG_0572.JPG



Might be another source for Minotaurs : P

Might be another source for Minotaurs

I saw a thread on heroscapers that the Arcane Legion minis are real small and thin in comparison.

Minotaurs at 90 sound OK to me.

If played right, do you think Tecer is worth 110, or should he be lowered? How did Bull Rush fare?

Do you think Apeo is worth 30 or should he be bumped a little? Was his added die bonus too much for a 30 pointer?

The Minotaurs are close at 90. These guys are the hardest to peg for me.

Tecer performed decently. I am good with 110, maybe 105.

Apeo is good at 30. He will kill a couple of figures if given the chance, but if attacked a couple of times he is a goner.

I would love to see what a couple more playtests show these guys at.

I'll get you some better pics today.

Curious on how Sir Orrick has been performing, since I haven't played him yet

first games I used Orrick myself. He is alright- could have been 40 pts in my opinion.

NAME OF THE TEST UNIT: Minotaurs of Nullandia

THEME TEST: Are there are any powers or stats on the test unit card that do not accurately reflect the theme or likeness of what the character should be able to do? Also consider whether or not this character's powers should affect destructible objects.

I do think they feel like a minotaur should, and that the powers are accurately reflected.


FUN TEST: Was the unit fun to play?

Yes, stout defensively and pack a punch offensively.


FUN OPPOSITION TEST: Was the unit acceptable to play against? Could it be considered annoying?

Yes. Not anything annoying that I could think of.


USAGE TEST: Were all of the powers on this card used, or at least usable?

Scent of Prey was used but Gore was not. Only 1 time could it have been used and the Minotaur was only 1 space away from Subakna.


STRATEGY TEST: Does the unit offer any real strategy or interesting tactics to the overall game?

Trying to keep the possibility of Gore is interesting.

BONDING TEST: Compare the unit card with all currently existing Bonding abilities. Are there any Bonding loops that do not stop appropriately?

Tecer and Apeo only so far and do not see any bonding loops.


SYNERGIES TEST: Think of all the current cards that would have synergy with the unit card. Are there any factors that could break the game by making a unit too powerful or too weak?

Not that I can see.


POWER CHECK: When considering the test unit against all existing units (including released C3V and SoV units) and all glyphs, are there any powers that could be overamplified and break the game? Each power should define when it takes place, who or what it affects, and what conditions (if any) apply.

Not that I can see.


DRAFTING TEST: Is this unit worth drafting?

I think so.


MIRROR TEST: Consider the test unit against itself. Are there any loops that would upset the balance of the Game?

Not that I see.



ARMY TEST 1

Did the unit perform adequately? What should be the unit's point value? Give a brief summary.
[Yes they performed adequately. Apeo did ok. Tecer did not get 110 pts worth before falling. I think the Minotaurs are worth 85-90. Tecer 100-110, Apeo is fine at 30-40. The Minotaurs on the Glyph of Wannok was the real difference here as it took away some snacks and caused some leaving engagements and giving up height, and rendered the Marro Warriors to an early demise. Tecer went after the start zone and while he got a few figures he fell to a few low attack rolls relatively quick. ]


Map: [Steaming Bridge Revisited]
Units: Army 1: [Minotaurs x4 (360) Tecer (110) Apeo (30)] ([500]) VS Army 2: [Nagrubs x4(120) Marro Warriors (50) Subakna (160) Torkulna (220)] ([550])

Rd 1- Tecer gets a sacrificial Nagrub, Minotaurs occupy the glyph of Wannok, Kill a Nagrub.
Torkulna misses on a Minotaur while Nagrubs move to support him.
Wannok kills a Nagrub

RD 2- Tecer moves towards oppoonents start zone, 2 Minotaurs follow suit, while 3rd puts 2 wounds on whiffing Torkulna.
Torkulna snacks a Nagrub, revenges his wounds while a Nagrub lands on PitTrap, and miss attack on tied down Tecer and Minotaur.
Tecer takes a leaving engagement wound to get 2 attacks on Marro Warriors killing 1. 2 Minotaurs move towards Torkulna, 3rd kills a Nagrub.
Marro Warrior w/height puts 2nd wound on Tecer, 2nd attack blocked, 3rd attack on a Minotaur blocked.
Tecer kills a Marro Warrior & Nagrub, a Minotaur is blocked by a Marro Warrior, put 2 Minotaurs attack Torkulna for 4 wounds.
Marro Warrior whiffs on Tecer and blocked by a Minotaur.
Wannok kills a Nagrub

Rd 3- Torkulna eats a Nagrub, kills a Minotaur. 1 Nagrub moves next to Torkulna, 2 move to height for 2 wounds and kill on Tecer.
Apeo moves across center bridge, Minotaur blocked by Marro Warrior, Minotaur wounds Torkulna.
Torkulna kills a Minotaur, Nagrub moves next to Torkulna, 1 moves that way, 3rd blocked by a Minotaur.
Apeo climbs wall attacks up at a Marro Warrior but blocked with 3 of 4 shields. A Minotaur blocked by Marro Warrior but kill a Nagrub.
Torkulna snacks and moves back to 2 more Nagrubs.
Apeo kills a Marro Warrior, a Minotaur uses SoP to get height on Torkulna who rolls a perfect 5 shields, while another misses a Marro Warrior.
Minotaur safe on Lava, Wannok kills a Nagrub.

Rd 4- Torkulna snacks last Nagrub, moves to height and kills a Minotaur.
Apeo 1 wounds Torkulna, 2 Minotaurs move along road, 3rd blocked by stubborn Marro Warrior.
Subakna kills Apeo with 4 skull roll.
A Minotaur gets the last Marro Warrior.
Subakna kills a Minotaur on the bridge.
Minotaurs attack on Torkulna (height) blocked, another 1 wounds Subakna.
Torkulna safe on Lava, takes a wound from Wannok.

Rd 5- Subakna safe on leaving engagement swipe and w/ height kills a Minotaur.
2 Minos attack Torkulna who blocks both, 3rd moves out of Start Zone.
Torkulna kills a Minotaur.
Minotaur blocked by Torkulna, another puts 2 wounds on Subakna.
Subakna takes a L.E. wound to get to Minotaur on Wannok for kill.
2 Minotaurs with height kill Subakna while 3rd kills Torkulna with 3 of 4 shields.

4 Minotaurs left.


Final thoughts- Even with 50 less pts. to start with the Minotaurs pulled off victory due in large part to Wannok. The decision to try and get to the Wannok occupying Minotaur with the Marro Warriors in the 2nd round backfired as they could never get an attack off in that direction. The large size of the Minotaurs definitely hurt some of Torkulna’s effectiveness, but all in all a fun and relatively even match.

Damon and I ran a few playtests with these guys tonight and thought they were appropriate. In 2 games they beat 2x Fen Hydra, Finn, Kelda, and Krav substantially one game do to glyphs in a large part (removal of markers as the end result of demise not seen when placing order markers), and really poor play the 2nd game. They will be very competitive at their points and relatively easy to play but the are not invincible.

Very cool!! You've done extensive work in the playtesting here so I am confident that they'll be awesome and well received!!!

Glad you guys got some 'Scape in!!

Peace, *Kai

Yep, I'm sold that these guys should proceed to final editing. The minotaurs are a very fun army!

I'm working on the card . . .

Can we change gore to read the following?

GORE
If a Minotaur of Nullondia starts his movement unengaged, you may use Gore. To use Gore, move the Minotaur of Nullondia in a straight line. If the Minotaur of Nullondia ends his movement engaged or next to a destructible object you may roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 14 or higher the defending figure or destructible object receives a one wound. You may add one to your die roll for each space between the defending figure and the Minotaur of Nullondia's original placement. If a Minotaur of Nullondia fails to inflict a wound with Gore, he may not attack this turn.

That is all I would change after very careful reading and theorizing except for moving the bonding power to the top of the list of specials on the card.

Fire Elemental says "receive 1 wound."
http://www.heroscapers.com/community/gallery/files/2/9/2/3/hs_fire_elemental_original.jpg

Marrden Hounds says" receive a wound."
http://www.hasbro.com/common/images/heroscape/characters/master/8910683F-219F-489A-95B6-4E4DC50DED6C.jpg

oh my, so there is enough variability with current HS cards to go with what feels right to us? I know there is, I'm just playing.

I'm good with whatever - just hadn't seen "a wound" in my searching. 1, a, or one all work for me.

Gore

If a Minotaur of Nullondia starts his movement unengaged, you may use Gore. To use Gore, move the Minotaur of Nullondia in a straight line. If the Minotaur of Nullondia ends his movement engaged or next to a destructible object you may roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 14 or higher the defending figure or destructible object receives a wound. You may add one to your die roll for each space between the defending figure and the Minotaur of Nullondia's original placement. If a Minotaur of Nullondia fails to inflict a wound with Gore, he may not attack this turn.

If a Minotaur of Nullondia starts his movement unengaged, you may use Gore.  To use Gore, move a Minotaur of Nullondia in a straight line.  If that Minotaur of Nullondia ends it's movement engaged or next to a destructible object you may roll the 20-sided die.  If you roll a 14 or higher the defending figure or destructible object receives 1 wound.  You may add one to your die roll for each space between the defending figure and that Minotaur of Nullondia's original placement.  If a Minotaur of Nullondia fails to inflict 1 wound with Gore, he may not attack this turn.

Changed his to it's- although I am ok with his.  I think 1 or one would be better as with the two examples given the hounds can only give a wound- regardless of how many are next to a certain figure, while the fire elementals can give multiple 1 wounds to the same figure, which is more in line with the Minotaurs.

Changed back to his and updated OP.

Native to the labyrinth of dark caves in the base of the Nullondia Mountains, the Minotaurs of Nullondia have a heightened scent of smell. Often they will catch their enemies unprepared as they rush into battle, crushing their enemies with little or no casualties of their own.

short and simple bio, as always looking for suggestions.

Suggestions for the bio?

Yes. These guys are pretty tough - I wouldn't mind some elaboration . . . Sorry for the long delay. Life gets too busy sometimes.

Muscles are flexed, glistening with sweat, caked with dirt. Mighty minotaurs lurk, preparing for their charge. Native to the labyrinth of dark caves in the base of the Nullondia Mountains, the Minotaurs of Nullondia have a heightened scent of smell and a strong desire to create chaos amongst their enemies. Often they will catch their enemies unprepared as they rush into battle, crushing their foes with little or no casualties of their own.

More elaboration welcome . . .

I am going to work with the current pics to finish up the cards in the hope to have them out the door by the New Year. If they don't work out, I'll have Caitlin bring her camera down to get some pics.

I will update the op with your creative additions to the bio. I will try and take some better pictures for you tomorrow afternoon.

Feedback?

Looks sweet!

NICE!! Those pics are awesome and they make the Minotaurs look incredibly fierce!!

OP updated with relevant info and improved bio.

Released on 12/31 and posted on Heroscapers. Happy Birthday, Derek!

I fixed a typo on the Minotaurs card - scent of prey had "it's" instead of "its." Changes made on HS as well.

Awesome! The other two Minotaurs I needed arrived today so I actually have a complete squad now : )